Productivity Commission, Parliamentary Superannuation, Immigration, Border Protection, GST, Euthanasia, and Competition policy Mark Latham - Leader of the Opposition

Radio Interview with Mario Derazio

Transcript - 6PR Perth - 18 December 2003

INTERVIEWER: Mark Latham is here to take your calls on 92211233. In breaking news Mark if I could just put a couple of things to you quickly, the Productivity Commission has recommended banning, that millionaires should be banned from receiving the $7000 first home owners grant. The Commission is releasing its report in Canberra as we speak, we understand that the Treasurer Peter Costello is about to say something about that, what do you make of all of this? $7000 grant to people who actually are worth millions of dollars, that grant has also driven up home prices no doubt.

LATHAM: I'm glad to hear the Productivity Commission saying that because it's long standing Labor policy to better target the first home owners grant and we've said for some several years that we wouldn't make it available to million dollar home owners. It just seems to be way out of line with the community standard where you have got to get the money where it's needed most. If someone can afford a million dollar home they really don't need a public subsidy. So that's been our long standing position and I'm glad to hear the Productivity Commission making recommendations along those lines. We have got to do a lot more to improve housing affordability in Australia and some better targeting of that scheme would make a big difference.

INTERVIEWER: Prices have gotten horribly out of control over the last couple of years.

LATHAM: They've gone through the roof. I mean you can move from capital city to capital city and regional centres as well. The prices have gone way up and there is no overnight solution, we've got to do, I think, six or seven things to improve housing affordability in Australia. For the next generation of young people, we don't want them to move into a society of renters we want to be a society of owners and keep the great Australian dream of home ownership alive. Hopefully this Productivity Commission report will come up with some good recommendations and the Federal Government can start moving in that direction.

INTERVIEWER: In essence though if you are elected you would keep something along the lines of the first home owners scheme? Would you extend it? Would you curtail it? How would you calibrate it?

LATHAM: We've got our policy to knock of the million dollar homeowners receiving the money and I'm happy to look at other recommendations that might come out of the report today on targeting of that scheme. The important thing to do is ensure that people who most need assistance from the public purse receive it. The scheme itself, we need to remember, is just compensation for the GST. It used to be $14000 but the $7000 is just straight compensation for the GST on housing. We need a scheme of this kind but more effective targeting and ensuring that millionaires don't receive it, I think, is a pretty good step.

INTERVIEWER: Alright you've been in Perth a couple of days, you've been dropping bombshells all over the place, a lot of talking points, the first thing I'd like to put to you is superannuation for politicians. Are you pretty determined to cut that?

LATHAM: I can't support the existing scheme and I know our Shadow Minister for Superannuation, Nick Sherry is doing a lot of policy work right across the whole spectrum of super. He'll be saying some things about our superannuation policy in the new year but I'm acutely aware of the public unease about Parliamentarian Superannuation because it is way outside the community standard. The scheme itself was devised decades ago when MPs where a lot older. They retired at an older age and that was sort of their pension but now you've got a ridiculous situation where people can move out of the Parliament in their thirties and receive so much money for the rest of their lives, that's way out of line with public standards and expectations.

INTERVIEWER: You'd be prepared to take less money yourself?

LATHAM: We're going to have a look at our policy in the new year. I'm just saying I find it very hard to defend the existing scheme. The other thing that's changed over the years is when the scheme was brought in it was said that politicians would find it hard to get another job. Now when people leave the Parliament invariably they go to a higher paying job, often in the corporate sector so there aren't too many MPs that are down on their luck after their time in Parliament. For all those reasons I can't defend the existing scheme and my spokesperson Nick Sherry is doing some work right across the board on super and obviously we've got our policy processes to go through. We'll be in a better position to talk about the detail in 2004.

INTERVIEWER: 92211233 is the number to call if you'd like to speak with Mark Latham the Leader of the Opposition. Amanda Vanstone says that the asylum seekers in Nauru is not Australia's problem.

LATHAM: That's an amazing statement. This is a policy set up by the Australian Government, it's set up by her Government.

INTERVIEWER: They are our problem?

LATHAM: The asylum seekers are only there because of the policies of the Howard Government so having set up the so called Pacific Solution it seems amazing that the Minister can turn around and wipe her hands of any responsibility. I think there is an Australian Government responsibility given the fact it's an Australian Government policy to set the detention up in Nauru in the first place. Amanda Vanstone needs to face up to her responsibility. The solution wouldn't be easy and we don't support the strategy in the first place but I think that as the responsible Minister she's got to take a bit of responsibility for what her Government has done in the past.

INTERVIEWER: She says that if they want to leave they can.

LATHAM: That might be right but she's also saying that, she's taking no responsibility for something that has been a Howard Government policy. There wouldn't be detention centres in Nauru, this so called Pacific Solution, if the Australian Government didn't decide that in the first place. So having decided that they have got to take some obligation for what's happening.

INTERVIEWER: On that very subject let's take our first call. Frank from Nollamara, good morning Frank.

FRANK: Good morning gentlemen. Mark do you go along with Carmen Lawrence and close down these detention centres and put these so called refugees in a six month visa until we find out who they are and what they are?

LATHAM: No I believe in mandatory detention in Australia. We need an orderly processing system. Labor's policy is to do it a lot faster than the current government. There is obviously a huge taxpayers expense in keeping people in detention for four or five years. It becomes a system of punishment for them so our strategy is to process 90% of the asylum seekers within 90 days and as much as possible try and ensure that nobody is there longer than twelve months. I think that we can have a quick and effective processing of mandatory detention in Australia and that's the best way to go.

INTERVIEWER: Alright thanks very much for your…

FRANK Hang on a minute. Hang on.

INTERVIEWER: Alright Frank one more quickly.

FRANK: How can that be when you say that they've got to have three courts of appeal?

LATHAM: I don't say that Frank. We're saying that we'd have 90% of the asylum seekers processed within 90 days.

INTERVIEWER: 92211233 if you'd like to speak with Mark Latham, the Federal Leader of the Opposition. Good morning Phil.

PHIL: Good morning Mark. Good morning Mario.

LATHAM: G'day Phil.

PHIL: Well done Mark you're the man mate. Listen there's a lot of people out here realise, just by what we're hearing at the moment, is that when you get close to the phone on things and people start trying to put out the bushfires before it gets to them like Costello is doing at the moment, cutting a lot of your ideas off before they get too popular, so he's jumping on the bandwagon and doing a lot of your stuff. Well we know what's going on down here mate and you keep up the good work and we wish you all the best and who knows? One day the big job mate.

LATHAM: Thanks Phil I appreciate your support and I'm trying to be positive in this job. I don't believe in opposition for opposition's sake. If the Government is doing something that is good for the country I'll say that but areas such as bulk billing and affordable education, where they've got it wrong, well I want Labor to be there with a positive alternative. We don't want to be a negative opposition. We want to be positive they are good ideas for the country's future and I'm very determined to keep up that approach.

INTERVIEWER: Is banning suspect terror groups good for the country?

LATHAM: Absolutely. You don't want to have terror groups with any legal status and capacity to operate in Australia. Of course we've got to crack down on terrorist organisations and have an effective means of keeping the Australian people safe and secure.

INTERVIEWER: In the last couple of days Robert McClelland appears to have announced a strategy on your, on the party's behalf to actually curb, change its existing policy.

LATHAM: No he's acting on authorisation of our Parliamentary party on the 2^nd of December to negotiate with Minister Ruddock in the national interest and ensure that all our concerns, our requirement for safeguards and review processes would be met. So Robert McClelland is negotiating in good faith with the Howard Government to try and get the best proscription regime available in place and I think that's important. I say we want to be a positive opposition and that means sitting down with the Government from time to time to try and do things that are in the Australian national interest. He is acting within party policy and I'm a bit disappointed that yesterday the Prime Minister tried to make political point scoring out of this instead of getting down to the negotiating process to get the best regime in place to make the Australian people secure.

INTERVIEWER: Yes indeed I suppose. He said he'll believe it when he sees it.

LATHAM: He can believe it because he sees our Shadow Minister at the negotiating table with our Minister so why scoff at that? Why be negative when here's the opposition trying to be positive? I think the Prime Minister needs to get down to the basic reality that his biggest responsibility is to keep the Australian people safe and secure. He has got an opposition that's willing to negotiate on these important issues.

INTERVIEWER: Good morning James.

JAMES: Good morning Mark, welcome to Western Australia.

LATHAM: Thank you very much James.

JAMES: Before I brush on what I want to talk about I'm grateful for your support to the gay population of Australia, for your support in helping them with their rights.

LATHAM: Yes absolutely, I announced recently our commitment for equal rights for gay people in the superannuation system.

JAMES: I have a gay son in federal politics so he'll be grateful for your support. The GST – what's your attitude to it? I mean Kim Beazley had to try and sell it in the last election where he was opposed to it and I think that turned a lot of voters off the Labor Party. What's your attitude to it?

LATHAM: We're treating it as one of the many taxes in the federal system, we've got the highest taxing government in Australia's history and there are different options for tax relief. We're treating the GST on the same footing as other taxes where we have a concern, the high level of PAYE tax, the sugar tax the milk tax that's been imposed on the Australian people so we won't have a dedicated strategy like Roll Back. We're treating the GST on the same footing as the other taxes in the system and we take the general proposition that working people need a bit of relief. They've got the highest taxes ever in Australia's history and the honest PAYE taxpayer is working hard and doing the right thing. When the taxes go up year by year they also require some relief.

INTERVIEWER: What's your plan then, releasing a detailed economic strategy?

LATHAM: We've been working on productivity and competition strategies and in relation to tax of course, it's not possible to do the detail until we see the sums in the Federal Budget in May next year. So there's a while to go on that but we're working away on some different options and when the final budget figures are in place we'll have a very responsible taxation policy that's in the national interest.

INTERVIEWER: OK let's take another call, good morning Jerry.

JERRY: Yes look I get very annoyed when people who arrive here illegally by boat are called asylum seekers. We've had a case of Baktiaris, they said they were from Afghanistan, they were from Pakistan, why do they need to come in and lie to us? Now we've also had the deported people smuggling those 14 Turks by a Sydney Turk. Now he was, he arrived here by boat as an asylum seeker and it has been revealed he was such an asylum seeker that his wife and kids went back to Turkey.

LATHAM: They're people seeking asylum, unfortunately in some cases people smugglers are involved and one of the regrettable things is that boat that came down to Melville Island. The Government sent it back but they sent back the people smugglers instead of arresting them. Why send them back, people smugglers, to do their worst a second or third time? They should have been arrested and we've got to clamp down on the people smugglers and the asylum seekers, we've got to check their credentials. If they're genuine refugees they get welcomed into the Australian community. If they're not genuine they have to go home.

INTERVIEWER: Thanks for your call Jerry. Let's take another call, Elizabeth good morning.

ELIZABETH: Good morning.

LATHAM: Good morning Elizabeth.

ELIZABETH: Oh, good morning. I wanted to ask you Mr Latham, if you became a Labor Leader and leader of our country what would be Labor's position on euthanasia under a new generation?

LATHAM: In the Parliament we have a free vote on that. It's what's known as a conscience matter. There was a vote some time ago in response to changes in the Northern Territory law and there wouldn't be a formal Labor position. We give our members a free vote to determine on their own conscience how they see that particular issue. I voted in support of the Northern Territory laws some six or seven years ago but I've got to say I've been rethinking it. There have been some things out in the public arena that I've been concerned about so just in terms of my own individual position as a Member of Parliament I'd want to have a long think about it if the matter came before the Parliament again. We wouldn't have a collective Labor Party position. It's a matter for the individual member and his or her conscience on euthanasia.

INTERVIEWER: Are you more or less likely to support it next time round do you think?

LATHAM: I'm concerned about some of the things and the cases that have been out there in the public arena. There was the women in Queensland and the involvement of one of the doctors in particular, so that's got me thinking again about the issue. I haven't, it's not before the Parliament but I suppose I've just reassessed my own view that some of the evidence I've seen is disturbing. If people aren't fatally ill and euthanasia is applied then obviously it's a terrible terrible thing. I'll be wanting to rethink my position from first principles if it ever came before the Parliament again.

INTERVIEWER: Alright. 92211233 that's the number to call, we're chatting with Mark Latham, the Leader of the Federal Labor Party.

INTERVIEWER: We are chatting with Mark Latham, the alternative Prime Minister, the man who would be PM if a Labor Party is elected into office. Mark we were just talking about security issues, in Western Australia people feel extremely vulnerable, one third of the country's entire coastline is here. You have resurrected an idea of a Coast watch, critics are saying that is fanciful, that is going to be so expensive to actually implement.

LATHAM: We feel it is absolutely essential for Australia's border protection and national security. We are an island continent with 37,000 kilometres of coastline, we need a Coastguard to make sure that it is safe from the people smugglers, the drug runners and the like, and Western Australia has over 10,000 kilometres of coastline and part of our coastguard fleet would be stationed out of Broome. So it would be on the job protecting Western Australia and ensuring that right around the country our vast coastline has a bit of protection from all the things that can go wrong.

INTERVIEWER: Isn't the Navy good enough to do this?

LATHAM: The Navy is there to fight military engagements and Coastguard has got some military capacity.

INTERVIEWER: Would this work with the Navy?

LATHAM: Of course, it would be working with the Navy but it is a dedicated Coastguard. The Navy is dedicated to military engagements and that is a very important function but you can also have a dedicated coastguard, it happens in the United States for example. It is an established system and I just think that it is overdue for a country like ours with the world's longest coastline to get a Coastguard, a cop on the beat 24 hours a day 7 days a week.

INTERVIEWER: Have you done the sums on it?

LATHAM: Yes we have a policy there, a fully costed policy of about 600 million dollars and it is not just the fleet it is also some extra radar capacity, a voluntary effort, we have a lot of boats and people who would be involved in Coast watch on a voluntary basis. We want to have a whole huge national effort to ensure that the Coastguard and the Coast watch volunteers who are involved in protecting our vast coast line are working together in an integrated way to make sure that Australia is a safe place.

INTERVIEWER: Ok lets take some calls; good morning Richard

RICHARD: Good morning Mr Latham.

LATHAM: Good morning Richard

RICHARD: I just wanted to talk about your back flip on your position on America and just wanting to know, don't you think it is a bit hypocritical now that you have labelled George Bush the most dangerous President that America has ever had, and being an open critic of the Iraq war over and over when it was being waged that all of a sudden you draped yourself in the American flag at a recent press conference, don't you think somehow that it is a major back flip and you are just pandering to the Australian electorate?

LATHAM: No, I am still a critic of the Iraq war and I have said consistently that even with the luxury of hindsight Labor wouldn't be changing it's position. We thought that the war was unnecessary in the way in which it was waged, it was supposed to identify weapons of mass destruction and eliminate them, well none were used during the conflict and none have been found since so our critique of that war remains in place. There was a full on debate earlier in the year and in the context of that debate strong language was used, but that is not surprising given that you are sending young Australian men and women off potentially to fight for their lives.

I am a supporter of the American Alliance and I think it the Alliance is fundamental to Australia's security, and in terms of the flag, on that occasion John Curtin the great Western Australian Prime Minister was looking down from the wall and I really don't feel that Curtin would have been unhappy to see the American and Australian flags together, given the fact that in World War Two he brought those flags together to save our nation from invasion, let's not forget that and Labor established the American Alliance, it's not a rubber stamp we do not always agree there have been some celebrated disagreements, Whitlam and Nixon, Hawke and Reagan and earlier this year we disagreed with George Bush on his strategy in Iraq. So the Alliance is important but from a Labor perspective it is never a rubber stamp, we have the capacity to disagree and then move on to the future and still try to work together.

INTERVIEWER: Was Tony Blair dishonest?

LATHAM: I was certainly disappointed with the decision of the Blair Government as I was with the Bush Administration, obviously the Howard Government here.

INTERVIEWER: Dishonesty?

LATHAM: That is not a term I would use.

INTERVIEWER: Your security spokesperson uses that term, at least as quoted in The Australian

LATHAM: Well it is not a term that I would use, I would use disappointment in terms of my own judgement of the decision of the Blair Government. As for honesty and dishonesty, I think that is best judged in their system where they have a vigorous Westminster Parliamentary System and I am sure that many rigorous things have been said about Tony Blair even within his own British Labour Party. Sure Robert McClelland has said the same sort of criticism here, that is part of our democracy but I would rather stick with disappointment with the Blair Government's decision, I think it was the wrong decision but as with the Americans of course we want to maintain a good working relationship with the British Government and we move on to the future to try and win the war against terror.

INTERVIEWER: Good morning John.

JACK: Good morning Mario, morning Mark. You going to knock back this 12 and a half per cent on the LPG?

LATHAM: Well no we thought that was inappropriate decision yesterday, our biggest concern is the Ethanol subsidies. There was a report recently that it would cost $500,000 a job, the Government are spending that much money on Ethanol and the report said that it is not in the national interest. So I am worried about some of the waste that taxpayers money in ethanol subsidies, that I thought that the concession there for LPG is pretty important on environmental grounds and for the 500,000 users of LPG in this country. So we can support that decision but the flip side about Ethanol we are heavily sceptical about the Government's plan and the effectiveness for the Australian taxpayer.

INTERVIEWER: Good Morning Jack.

JACK: Good morning Mario and how are you going Mark? Mark, I just wanted to support you on the point of the Coastguard, when you think that 70 to 80 per cent of all crime and 70 to 80 per cent of all those incarcerated in the jails are drug related, that is billions and billions of dollars, and even if we could cut that by 20 per cent we would be saving money, so I would just say that. But my biggest question is and it has offended me greatly is that stand over man Abbott and clown Costello has stopped West Australia from getting money on the Competition Commission, with the 75 million dollar carrot offered but we don't know to who, maybe the big business in town, but nobody was going to gain if we did what Mr Costello's, well party line that we would just lift all competition and shops would be open 24 hours a day, there is only the big boys that could do that, they would just run every one out of town as the experience has been in Sydney of late. All the small shops have gone you have only got the big companies just charging what they like. Would you go along that line as Costello did hold back 43 million dollars from Western Australia because we did not tow the party line, like competition between Federal and State Governments?

LATHAM: I think he is getting into competition matters now where you do not get big gains in terms of national productivity and economic growth so it is a bit heavy handed to have this extent of penalty. In the Labor Party we have got that last stage of national competition policy under review. But the bigger thing is, I certainly share your concern about the lack of competition in the retail sector, we have a heavily concentrated sector here, the big two companies have got 80 per cent of the market and we are losing too many of our independent grocers and retailers, we have to build up the Trade Practices Act, restore the effectiveness of section 46 of use of market power so that small business in this country gets a bit of protection from some of the predatory practices of big business. I certainly share your concern there abut the lack of competition in retail and grocery and we want to build up the Trade Practices Act and ensure the consumer has competition, lower prices and better service in the future.

INTERVIEWER: That point about the NCC and competition, the argument in WA was that Geoff Gallop had not made a public interest submission to the NCC and that is why they got knocked back, but I see that Carr was accused of the same thing also that you have got a whole bunch of states not actually stating their case clearly to the NCC. I also note that you suggest that there is an enormity of market power, how are you going to clear all this up and make sure that consumers get a good deal?

LATHAM: The first step is to restore the effectiveness of the Trade Practices Act, we need to put some real teeth into that Section 46, that stops abuse of market power by big business in Australia. We need to have a common sense position about these competition payments because the deregulation of the liquor industry, I have seen law and order experts saying that it will increase the number of alcohol related crimes. I have seen health experts say it will increase the number of alcohol related illnesses and surely common sense would say that in most of our big cities it is not too hard to find a drink, buy a can of beer or whatever your taste might be. But let's not get silly to the point where we are adding the problem of alcohol related crime and illness in our society. I think competition has got to have a sensible limit and I think we are reaching that in the way in which Canberra trying to deal with these issues.

INTERVIEWER: You have got a couple of Premiers who are not putting their cases strikingly enough, would you keep the onus on the State to make these arguments?

LATHAM: Geez, I have heard some pretty striking comments by Bob Carr and by Geoff Gallop about all these issues. I don't know many Premiers who are sort of shrinking violets, who never put their case. They are all pretty vigorous in standing up for the interests of their states, in my experience and sometimes in the Labor Party we have the odd disagreement so, I don't think Bob Carr and Geoff Gallop need a megaphone to get their point across. I think they are always on the air waves and always arguing their case and if Peter Costello hasn't heard it, he just needs to listen a bit closer.

INTERVIEWER: I understand you are spending your holidays in Western Australia.

LATHAM: Yes we are heading down south, my wife comes from Kenwick and we have the two little boys and we have holiday place lined up between Bunbury and Busselton. We are looking forward to building sand castles and spending time with the family, kicking back a bit because I rather suspect Mario that 2004 is going to be pretty busy for me, so here is a chance to enjoy the WA sunshine, the beaches and have a great Christmas that I am really looking forward to.

INTERVIEWER: Just looking at the tone of Peter Costello in the last few days and the poll results that you seem to be getting, are you approaching next year more confident?

LATHAM: I am always happy to engage with that old comedy routine of Abbott and Costello, they liven up my days, day in day out and they just need to polish up their act a bit.